Mr. Speaker, the Liberal Party is pleased to support this legislation. Logic and natural justice seem to make it clear that an individual should not benefit from a crime, particularly when that crime is murder. The murder of a spouse, the murder of anyone, is obviously an extremely serious crime, so we do not want the system to be such that an individual who murders his or her spouse would benefit through the collection of any kind of government benefits. This legislation would stop that from happening for both Canadian pension plan benefits and old age security benefits.

We are told by the Library of Parliament that it may happen to be a policy of the government, which is not law. I am not sure if that is correct, but whether or not it is correct, it is a principle that is worth enshrining in law so that there is absolutely no doubt that it is the law of the land. We in the Liberal Party have no hesitation whatsoever in offering our support to the bill.

Right at the core of the bill is old age security, and old age security is an important issue for Canadians in a number of areas. To deprive an individual of the OAS benefits of his or her murdered spouse is critical, important, and positive, but that might affect up to four dozen people, whereas the raising of the age for OAS from 65 to 67 must affect hundreds of thousands of people. Given the centrality of OAS in this particular private member's bill, it is worth spending a little time talking about OAS in the context of what affects thousands of Canadians.

The Liberal Party is opposed to the government's plan to increase the age of eligibility for old age security from 65 to 67. We oppose it for two reasons. First, contrary to what the government is saying, all of the experts are telling us that the current system is actually viable.

The government says that the system is not sustainable because of our aging population, but the chief actuary, the Parliamentary Budget Officer, and other worthy and qualified bodies and individuals say that it is. When asked to choose between the statement of the government on sustainability and the statement of these experts, I will go with the experts.

My second point is that even if we deny what the experts say and argue that the current system is unsustainable, there are different ways to make it sustainable. One is to increase the age from 65 to 67, which the government is proposing, but that is the most mean-spirited method. It would really hit the most vulnerable. If we really believe it is unsustainable, which I do not, another way would be to reduce the income level—

John McCallum

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